Comments on: Accelerated returns in food production http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production Accelerating Intelligence Thu, 20 Jun 2013 12:29:59 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.1 By: anthony http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-31301 anthony Thu, 06 Sep 2012 20:30:21 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-31301 Genetically modified organisms are the Frankenstein of the natural world, they may be gentle or they may be monsters. Because we cannot determine whether or not they are hazardous in a given ecosystem, it may be easier to stick with what's naturally available instead of investing in risky stock options. Aeroponics is even more viable than hydroponics as it uses a third less water for the same product! Genetically modified organisms are the Frankenstein of the natural world, they may be gentle or they may be monsters. Because we cannot determine whether or not they are hazardous in a given ecosystem, it may be easier to stick with what’s naturally available instead of investing in risky stock options.

Aeroponics is even more viable than hydroponics as it uses a third less water for the same product!

]]> By: anthony http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-31298 anthony Thu, 06 Sep 2012 20:26:17 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-31298 Aeroponics are even more viable as they use a third less water than hydroponics! And I agree, why would you try to design crops to suit a degraded ecosystem as opposed to taking the easy route and restoring the ecosystem to ideal growing conditions? Or instead plant a different crop which is more viable in the given system? Aeroponics are even more viable as they use a third less water than hydroponics!
And I agree, why would you try to design crops to suit a degraded ecosystem as opposed to taking the easy route and restoring the ecosystem to ideal growing conditions? Or instead plant a different crop which is more viable in the given system?

]]> By: anthony http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-31295 anthony Thu, 06 Sep 2012 20:21:49 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-31295 This is a nice thought, except that when you face the reality of the situation, the viability of industrial farming in the long term is impossible. Industrial farming slowly, but surely uses up all arable land, the ecosystem is limited to what it can produce. It is not valid to think that food can be produced out of thin air, it is a cycle by which a plant uses components (none of which can feed an animal on their own) to create an edible fruit, this fruit is a carrier of excess sugars and starch which a plant evolved to produce in hopes that an animal would process it to create carbon rich matter which would then be returned to the soil. We can extend this cycle out for millions of years as it is the system by which the world has continued existing since the first animals came to dwell on the land and it is a viable system for continuation of life on earth. Permaculture takes advantage of these cycles to create an artificial eco-system which is designed to serve humans, and any other animal which is essential to its functions. It is a horticultural based approach to food production and is the only system which is viable in the long term. We must not only seek to extend life for ourselves, but also life for the planet and we can do this through creating ethically based systems which return nutrients to the soil. This is regenerative as opposed to the current methods of food production which are degenerative, sustainable is in between and we can at least make it that far through using organic farming methods. This is a nice thought, except that when you face the reality of the situation, the viability of industrial farming in the long term is impossible. Industrial farming slowly, but surely uses up all arable land, the ecosystem is limited to what it can produce. It is not valid to think that food can be produced out of thin air, it is a cycle by which a plant uses components (none of which can feed an animal on their own) to create an edible fruit, this fruit is a carrier of excess sugars and starch which a plant evolved to produce in hopes that an animal would process it to create carbon rich matter which would then be returned to the soil. We can extend this cycle out for millions of years as it is the system by which the world has continued existing since the first animals came to dwell on the land and it is a viable system for continuation of life on earth.
Permaculture takes advantage of these cycles to create an artificial eco-system which is designed to serve humans, and any other animal which is essential to its functions. It is a horticultural based approach to food production and is the only system which is viable in the long term. We must not only seek to extend life for ourselves, but also life for the planet and we can do this through creating ethically based systems which return nutrients to the soil. This is regenerative as opposed to the current methods of food production which are degenerative, sustainable is in between and we can at least make it that far through using organic farming methods.

]]> By: Jim Mooney http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-30411 Jim Mooney Sat, 01 Sep 2012 05:37:20 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-30411 And if you want to look at it from a moral viewpoint, tissue engineering obviates the cruelties of factory farming. And if you want to look at it from a moral viewpoint, tissue engineering obviates the cruelties of factory farming.

]]> By: Dr-Tomorrow http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29567 Dr-Tomorrow Sun, 26 Aug 2012 06:39:15 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29567 The developing science of Aquaponics is a good example. Also to a lesser extent, the expanding body of knowledge known as Permaculture. With the growth of the digital web, it is now possible to research and synthesize all the best practices, inherited techniques, folk wisdom and previous growing experience in given climates, to achieve astonishing results. Plant guild databases are another great example, and answer such questions as which plants to co-grow so as to cross-pollinate, ward off insects and diseases, clean and scent the air, and cross-fertilize? Once again, the trend holds true. Due to "interconnectedness" of humanity, knowledge, skillsets and sophistication of processes continues to grow at an accelerated rate. The developing science of Aquaponics is a good example. Also to a lesser extent, the expanding body of knowledge known as Permaculture.
With the growth of the digital web, it is now possible to research and synthesize all the best practices, inherited techniques, folk wisdom and previous growing experience in given climates, to achieve astonishing results.
Plant guild databases are another great example, and answer such questions as which plants to co-grow so as to cross-pollinate, ward off insects and diseases, clean and scent the air, and cross-fertilize?

Once again, the trend holds true. Due to “interconnectedness” of humanity, knowledge, skillsets and sophistication of processes continues to grow at an accelerated rate.

]]> By: Bri http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29239 Bri Thu, 23 Aug 2012 00:51:23 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29239 When we were hunter gatherers, grain heads ripened sort of explosively. Hard to gather. We've altered the plants over the years to give better yields, by staying as seed heads longer. Then we used animals to increase our yields. Later machines. All these trends now are on steroids, from industrial farming to adding nutritional components genetically. Yea it accelerates, maybe at a slower rate. When we were hunter gatherers, grain heads ripened sort of explosively. Hard to gather. We’ve altered the plants over the years to give better yields, by staying as seed heads longer. Then we used animals to increase our yields. Later machines. All these trends now are on steroids, from industrial farming to adding nutritional components genetically. Yea it accelerates, maybe at a slower rate.

]]> By: Bri http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29236 Bri Thu, 23 Aug 2012 00:39:16 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29236 I'd agree with all you've said except for one factor. Life extention. In so short a period of time we will be able to extend our lives indefinitely. Not only that, but we will be youthful. If AI teamed with robots gets rid of jobs, one of the main ways we feel human is with family. That could be like gasoline on a fire I’d agree with all you’ve said except for one factor. Life extention. In so short a period of time we will be able to extend our lives indefinitely. Not only that, but we will be youthful. If AI teamed with robots gets rid of jobs, one of the main ways we feel human is with family. That could be like gasoline on a fire

]]> By: Bri http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29235 Bri Thu, 23 Aug 2012 00:30:16 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29235 And super weeds, not to mention an addiction to toxic pesticieds And super weeds, not to mention an addiction to toxic pesticieds

]]> By: melajara http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29221 melajara Wed, 22 Aug 2012 20:02:32 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29221 The short answer is, even with gain of productivity in food production, we should not overbreed . A classic to feed the debate: http://www.garretthardinsociety.org/articles/art_tragedy_of_the_commons.html The short answer is, even with gain of productivity in food production, we should not overbreed .

A classic to feed the debate:

http://www.garretthardinsociety.org/articles/art_tragedy_of_the_commons.html

]]> By: melajara http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29217 melajara Wed, 22 Aug 2012 19:52:35 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29217 The short answer is, even with (massive) gain of productivity in food production, we should not overbreed . A classic to illuminate the debate: http://www.garretthardinsociety.org/articles/art_tragedy_of_the_commons.html The short answer is, even with (massive) gain of productivity in food production, we should not overbreed .

A classic to illuminate the debate:

http://www.garretthardinsociety.org/articles/art_tragedy_of_the_commons.html

]]> By: ChuckNorris34 http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-29126 ChuckNorris34 Wed, 22 Aug 2012 02:28:45 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-29126 I couldn't agree with you more. Better be careful what we say about Monsanto......they will have us in court next. GMO's? Do these people realize what GMO's really are? I too am looking forward to the evolution of hydroponics and vertical farming, not cattle living knee-deep in their own feces. I couldn’t agree with you more. Better be careful what we say about Monsanto……they will have us in court next. GMO’s? Do these people realize what GMO’s really are?
I too am looking forward to the evolution of hydroponics and vertical farming, not cattle living knee-deep in their own feces.

]]> By: Rob Larson http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-28980 Rob Larson Mon, 20 Aug 2012 21:31:45 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-28980 Law of Accelerating Returns is just the old Adam Smith concept of supply and demand written anew. There's nothing unusual about our predicament. Even if population were to explode to the point where arable land would become a premium, the costs of vertical farming and in vitro animal husbandry would become more and more economical. The scarcity of arable land would drive the costs of conventional food production up, thus revealing a demand for what would become less expensive vertical farming and in vitro food production. One thing many people don't realize is that population, at least in the developed world, is declining. That's why the Japanese are considering building robots to care for the elderly, a task once performed by younger family members. The only nations whose populations are skyrocketing are those which still rely on subsistence farming as it requires a large number of human workers to perform. Adoption of industrial farming techniques by so-called Third World nations would not only end the need for more and more children, those nations would then be able to redirect the labor of the people to other pursuits, which would raise the standard of living and, incidentally, the cost of having children which would have the effect of lowering global population. China is exhibit number 2. Due to certain political peculiarities, China is a nation that is about to undergo an extreme deflation in population. Which is only made worse by a cultural predisposition to having male babies, will exacerbate the situation further. It's doubtful we'll get to 8 billion people much less the 9 billion, 15 billion or 30 billion predicted by some futurists. Law of Accelerating Returns is just the old Adam Smith concept of supply and demand written anew. There’s nothing unusual about our predicament. Even if population were to explode to the point where arable land would become a premium, the costs of vertical farming and in vitro animal husbandry would become more and more economical. The scarcity of arable land would drive the costs of conventional food production up, thus revealing a demand for what would become less expensive vertical farming and in vitro food production.

One thing many people don’t realize is that population, at least in the developed world, is declining. That’s why the Japanese are considering building robots to care for the elderly, a task once performed by younger family members. The only nations whose populations are skyrocketing are those which still rely on subsistence farming as it requires a large number of human workers to perform. Adoption of industrial farming techniques by so-called Third World nations would not only end the need for more and more children, those nations would then be able to redirect the labor of the people to other pursuits, which would raise the standard of living and, incidentally, the cost of having children which would have the effect of lowering global population.

China is exhibit number 2. Due to certain political peculiarities, China is a nation that is about to undergo an extreme deflation in population. Which is only made worse by a cultural predisposition to having male babies, will exacerbate the situation further. It’s doubtful we’ll get to 8 billion people much less the 9 billion, 15 billion or 30 billion predicted by some futurists.

]]> By: Mitchell Powell http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-28972 Mitchell Powell Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:05:17 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-28972 Have we seen any indication that the Law of Accelerating Returns applies to food production, or are we still waiting for it to begin? Have we seen any indication that the Law of Accelerating Returns applies to food production, or are we still waiting for it to begin?

]]> By: Grey http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-28905 Grey Mon, 20 Aug 2012 13:41:35 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-28905 I'm an economist from South Africa. I've been observing Kurzweil's view on the increasing rate at which technology improves. I can honestly subscribe to this way of thinking. Although I'd be a bit concerned with painting a company like Monsanto as some sort of hero, there seems to be a number of people concerned that its created the super root worm in the U.S. I’m an economist from South Africa. I’ve been observing Kurzweil’s view on the increasing rate at which technology improves. I can honestly subscribe to this way of thinking. Although I’d be a bit concerned with painting a company like Monsanto as some sort of hero, there seems to be a number of people concerned that its created the super root worm in the U.S.

]]> By: GatorALLin http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-28896 GatorALLin Mon, 20 Aug 2012 12:54:42 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-28896 I would think the access to education on how to farm efficiently and use the farming tools needed would also be a major part of this future farming. I was hoping Ray might touch on the changes of sharing education/info and also the translation of English to other languages where that could also be an issue. I would think Ray's same laws apply here... I would think the access to education on how to farm efficiently and use the farming tools needed would also be a major part of this future farming. I was hoping Ray might touch on the changes of sharing education/info and also the translation of English to other languages where that could also be an issue. I would think Ray’s same laws apply here…

]]> By: why06 http://www.kurzweilai.net/accelerated-returns-in-food-production/comment-page-1#comment-28845 why06 Mon, 20 Aug 2012 02:30:10 +0000 http://www.kurzweilai.net/?p=159552#comment-28845 Monsanto can die in a hole for all I care. What ever benefit GMO crops might have, their patent wars a legal battles along with the destruction of genetic diversity is more of a threat to the world then a solution. I look forward to hydroponics & vertical farms though, but something really needs to be addressed in the genetically modified crop business, lest we all be destroyed by one companies quest for profit. Monsanto can die in a hole for all I care. What ever benefit GMO crops might have, their patent wars a legal battles along with the destruction of genetic diversity is more of a threat to the world then a solution.

I look forward to hydroponics & vertical farms though, but something really needs to be addressed in the genetically modified crop business, lest we all be destroyed by one companies quest for profit.

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