Comments on: Rabbits kept alive by oxygen injections

By: cn arabic

cn arabic — Wed, 03 Apr 2013 23:16:13 +0000

I read somewhere that kidneys dispose of non-volatile acids produced in metabolism, so I suppose HCO3- would fall into that category. Additionally, your kidneys also control bicarbonate and NH3 production, so I image that would further help prevent a drastic pH drop. I couldn’t find anything about how long they can do this for though…

By: Coran

Coran — Mon, 02 Jul 2012 08:22:15 +0000

I’d rather pay a (possibly substantial) portion of my earnings to reward the people willing to participate in the experiments.

By: Bri

Bri — Sun, 01 Jul 2012 17:21:37 +0000

There is a great show on NPR(radio), a chemist comes on periodically. She talks with great concern, about the thirty thousand chemicals, invented each year. She says that not even one hundred have been extensively tested in total! We now know about BPH, an estrogen mimic, but we have no idea what any of the others might do. I’d prefer it were rabbits, but that is getting too expensive. Just remember to wiggle your ears and look cute and innocent!

By: Cybernettr

Cybernettr — Sun, 01 Jul 2012 01:18:27 +0000

I was watching a YouTube video the other day of a snake swallowing a live baby alligator out in the wild. The alligator struggled for at least 5 minutes before it finally suffocated to death.

Yes, nature can be very cruel, and this happens millions of times every day. I don’t believe in needless animal cruelty, and I have been known to avert my step while walking to avoid stepping on an ant, but some cruelty is necessary to avert greater unhappiness in the future.

Are all you people who are against animal experimentation willing to forego all the medical advances that have been the result of such experimentation? You’ll live about half as long as the rest of us.

By: GatorALLin

GatorALLin — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 16:31:56 +0000

Not sure how the fad started for rabbit feet as good luck? Maybe one of the versions of a pet rock that got twisted?

http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af261/GatorALLin/Other/rabbits.png

http://i1014.photobucket.com/albums/af261/GatorALLin/Other/Opps-I-PoopedHappyBunny.jpg

By: ashton

ashton — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 14:58:51 +0000

You’ve got no idea how intelligent rabbits can be….

By: Jonathan Cole

Jonathan Cole — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 20:08:50 +0000

For soldiers I imagine they will have collar equipment that will jab needles into their carotid arteries and inject a liquid form of this and pump it up into their brain. Then they can avoid brain damage for an hour while they are transported to a hospital, even if their heart has stopped. One of several Stimpacks they are likely to have soon.

By: Bri

Bri — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 18:54:22 +0000

Thirty seven posts! Let’s just get into a space ship and leave the planet to them. They’ just eat each other in peace. Everything is a parasite on somthing else. The bottom rung on the food chain is energy from the sun, whether sunlight or atomic. Of all the things to post about, animals it appears are they only thing worth talking about. It’s obvious humans don’t warrant this level of concern!

By: Rob B

Rob B — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 16:10:45 +0000

Im pretty sure shampoo that doesn’t dissolve your hair and cosmetics that don’t scar your wife have been solved centuries ago, for what its worth.

By: C

Fri, 29 Jun 2012 15:08:59 +0000

If aliens come here and need to do cruel experiments, I will suggest they use our rabbits. Problem solved.

By: Turk

Turk — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 12:26:16 +0000

I love animals. I don’t think I could intentionally hurt a critter (apocalypse not withstanding).

That being said. I love fried chicken, shampoo that doesn’t dissolve my hair, and cosmetics that don’t scar my wife. I’m pretty sure I’m not the only hypocrite out there ….

By: Coran

Coran — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 10:53:09 +0000

I think it’s safe to attribute the feeling of pain, fear of dying and will to live to animals as well as humans. Self-awareness is yet to be proved.

By: Coran

Coran — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 08:32:47 +0000

In the words of Mike Stoklasa: “Are you some kind of expert in things that have never, ever happened?”

By: Coran

Coran — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 08:18:08 +0000

A scientist suffocated a rabbit to death, for research. I’m pretty sure the rabbit didn’t sign a consent form. How is that not forcibly killing?
Survival of the fittest…so it’s ok for me to kill someone if it benefits me? I’m the fittest, their death would improve my survival….makes sense…
And I don’t eat meat :].

By: Coran

Coran — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 08:14:17 +0000

The worth we place on a life is arbitrary. We could follow it further and say that those with close genes are worth more than others. And boom, we have justification for racism and genocide.

By: Ken

Ken — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 05:55:39 +0000

So true. You have to sacrifice in order to advance.

By: Lord Penguin

Lord Penguin — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 03:22:01 +0000

The next step is to make implants that release these microparticles when blood oxygen drops below a certain level. The implants could be just about anywhere and the heart would pump it all over the body in seconds. Not just for people with higher risk of breathing problems, either, it could be used for firefighters, scuba divers, astronauts, etc. in case their air systems failed.

By: Mac

Mac — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:54:18 +0000

Human life itself is worth more than an animals, and if you believe otherwise, it is a genetic dead end, the individual in a species that does not value it’s own species over other species.

By: Mac

Mac — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:53:11 +0000

Nothing cruel about it……..Human interest trumps anthropomorphism.

By: Mac

Mac — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:52:02 +0000

I’ve long maintained there should be two classes in sports, stock and custom…….Those who whine about performance enhancing can stick to watching stock……Wanna guess which will be the most watched?

By: GatorALLin

GatorALLin — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:24:00 +0000

…have to agree with this comment… anyone that truly understands how far away we are from other possible life forms in the Universe…would also understand that any alien that could figure out a way around the speed of light..and distant space travel could also figure out unlimited power (stuff like cold fusion, etc). so in summary they would have EVERYTHING already figured out… maybe they want to spread life around the universe…but they sure don’t need anything from us like resources. hard to say if they were just curious enough to stop by and say hello… chances are we will hear them out there somehow millions of years before they could get here physically. I like the idea that we are actually one of only a few planets with intelligent life so far….. what if in a universe only 14 billion years old…what if we are one of the first? Of the 4.5 billion years our planet has even been her…we just showed up…and most would argue we are lucky to be here still…and after 10K years the last 100 have sure gone fast… what will the next 100 be like…? Of all the billions of species Ever on the earth…why only 1 that could ever make a radio tower… Of every planet in the universe… sure seems like a ton of them 3-300 to the 23rd power… but that huge number drops back down to only 3 if you divide by a factor of 1,000 just 8 times.. Our planet with Goldilocks conditions must have at least 8 factors where we are only 1 of 1,000. Just saying… what if we are first…. ? or what if we are just too far apart to ever find/hear anyone else….??

By: GatorALLin

GatorALLin — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:14:55 +0000

..me also…. I volunteer… sign me up…

By: GatorALLin

GatorALLin — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:13:11 +0000

….. they have already started to prove that 100% of the metal winners in the olympics all have the same gene that makes you more of an athlete..(maybe this gene is directly related to how efficient your bodies ability to use oxygen to perform in any sports activity?) .so should they open up a Non-athlete category to make it fair for the rest of us…?? You could argue genetic mutations give unfair advantage to some.

By: GatorALLin

GatorALLin — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 19:05:43 +0000

Just a guess…but maybe sports fans looking for that extra edge have been working for years to clean the blood, or add oxygen to it…. Maybe we can get Lance Armstrong to chime in here… now that he can’t race in the Ironman race… who needs animal testing when humans are pushing to break records and push their bodies to the limits for sports, etc… Yeah, improvements for health related issues are often the ones talked about to push the science… but I have a feeling sport fans are swimming longer, faster… running or cycling faster and NONE of this shows up on the steroid tests… imagine holding your breath for 15 minutes underwater….or if your body did not wear out due to oxygen burn… just saying.. its been going on now for years… I would love to see some No limits Olympics… (no testing category)… just that once you go into this new/ no limits category you can never go back to the normal group again.

By: Futuron

Futuron — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 18:39:26 +0000

I eat meat. I chew chickens up in my mighty jaw. If a rabbit has to die, so the creatures I care about (humans and highly intelligent animals) have a better chance of survival, then I accept that cruel choice, and I don’t expect any mercy from yet higher beings.

By: Mark Duran

Mark Duran — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 18:04:23 +0000

You’re right. Absolutely cruel. But who knew how long it would take to suffocate a rabbit when they’re getting oxygen injections. A pillow would be quicker. It will probably end up being used as an interrogation technique. We’re such a creepy species.

By: Geoffrey Pierce

Geoffrey Pierce — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:57:38 +0000

Good question.

By: Geoffrey Pierce

Geoffrey Pierce — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:56:29 +0000

That’s when they ended the experiment and restored the rabbit’s breathing. Don’t imagine they monitored the rabbits vitals and still allowed it to suffocate. There’s no reason to watch the rabbit die.

That said, I wish they didn’t have to use animals, but that’s current reality.

By: Gabor

Gabor — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:53:05 +0000

George, if extraterrestrials ever would touch down on Earth, they would not be here to exploit us. If they have the technology for interstellar travel, Earth (and the Solar System) would be just a tiny (insignificant) place that would be of no material use for them. Also their intelligence would be probably many-many times ours. Note I’m not talking double here but perhaps millions of times more intelligent. This would not mean that we would look like viruses for them because their higher intelligence would recognize that we are also intelligent beings (although on a much lower level). They would not treat us as animals (even though we are) because they would have no use for it and simply because they would know better. I’m a big sci fi movie fan but realize that most of them are way out of touch with reality and prays on our primal fears to make a buck. In simple terms, aliens are ALWAYS bad, otherwise the movie would be boring and the producers would lose money. Hence the term Science FICTION…

By: Gabor

Gabor — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:22:41 +0000

I love animals, never would intentionally kill one. Saying that, when was the last time you ate chicken?!? The intention of these experiments are not forcibly killing animals. If anyone has a doubt look at humans first. Every person in jail is “intentionally abused” by taking away their freedom. Why?!? Because every criminal act (including and especially murder) is a dysfunction of the brain. Essentially it’s the same thing as having cancer, the “patient” can’t help it. So are we punishing cancer patients? Why are we punishing (instead of curing) mental patients. The answer is simple! Because we don’t know any better at the moment. We have to isolate them and show a deterrent to others in an attempt to influence their neocortex to better control primary urges. Same thing with animals, we have millions (billions) of people suffering from diseases that animal experiments can help. Fortunately, computers are getting closer to the point where we can simulate the whole human body which will mean the happy ending of animal experiments. Until then it’s survival of the fittest…evolution!

By: Gorden Russell

Gorden Russell — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 17:03:43 +0000

My asthma has advanced into COPD. I’d love to take a shot of respirocytes to help out this research.

By: Rob B

Rob B — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 16:59:01 +0000

These experiments benefit *other* animals you mean.
By the same logic, benefits to one-group of red-heads doesn’t nullify any negative actions thrust upon a separate group of red-reads.

By: Rob B

Rob B — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 16:55:43 +0000

I can only assume the rabbits were anaesthetized prior to the procedure?

By: eldras

eldras — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 15:46:39 +0000

How do they know it only lasted 15 minutes?
How utterly cruel.

By: Coran

Coran — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 15:21:37 +0000

It’s about money. I think there’d no trouble in finding willing human volunteers. Those who understand the risks, and believe them worth the reward. Eg. 10% chance of dying and cutting their life short, in exchange $2m payout and be comfortable for life.
It boils down to money. We don’t use humans because animals are cheap and can’t say no.

By: Ben

Ben — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 15:16:30 +0000

how do they get the carbon bioxide out?

By: Coran

Coran — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 15:15:47 +0000

Let’s not forget that the intention of these experiments is to forcibly kill animals in order to benefit humans. Benefiting animals (which it may never do) is a byproduct.

By: aus

aus — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 15:03:45 +0000

Advances in medical science often translate over to veterinary science.

So in an indirect way these experiments do benefit animals.

By: Bill

Bill — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 14:53:03 +0000

Blair, forcing inmates to submit to experimentation is morally reprehensible and is the kind of thing that cheapens and brutalizes us all as a society.

By: Bill

Bill — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 14:50:44 +0000

George has a point. We have to be honest that we do nasty things to animals for our own benefit. We really don’t have much of a moral argument towards aliens who might do the same thing to us.

On the other hand, Aezel is also correct. There really isn’t currently viable alternatives for much of the testing that needs to be done with new therapies. We just have to try to be as humane as possible and limit the suffering as much as possible while getting the results.

By: Coran

Coran — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 14:30:37 +0000

Which goes back to, and supports, his first statement about extraterrestrials exploiting us. They would say “Take your pick: A human, or one of us”.

By: blair

blair — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 14:08:57 +0000

Or the gigantic prison population in the United States, they would work fine.

By: Chrispium

Chrispium — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 13:39:30 +0000

I volunteer George.

By: Aezel

Aezel — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 13:29:25 +0000

@George “There are always other methods to do experiments without subjecting animals to torture.”

It makes me cringe but unfortunately, you are wrong. There are not other ways to test things like this. Microbiology is complicated. Things that seems safe in computer models kill you when you actually try it. Eventually it comes down to somebody taking the needle full of it.

Who’s the guinea pig? Take your pick: either a rabbit, or your kid.

By: George

George — Thu, 28 Jun 2012 13:19:16 +0000

If we are ever visited by extraterrestrials, it will be difficult to defend their exploitation of us based on our horrific experiments on animals. There are always other methods to do experiments without subjecting animals to torture.