The future of cryonics debate between physicist Michio Kaku and Alcor CEO Max More
December 22, 2013
In response to a question, “What are the practical applications of cryogenics today, and what potential improvements can we expect 20 to 30 years down the line?” Michio Kaku, PhD, replied with a critique.
Max More, PhD, CEO of Alcor Life Extension Foundation, offered this response, noting that cryonics is “affordable by regular people. Ice does not form inside cells and cause them to explode. We also use an advanced cryoprotectant to prevent ice formation. We do not advertise that it’s a way to live forever.”
Comments (15)
by stevewaclo
Gordon (Primo Autodidact) Russell,
You have obviously been doing a lot of thinking about this topic subsequent to the first post (or before?).
Excellent entrepreneurial spirit, but why wait for the Lottery? Kickstarter!!
And even if the gurney part does not succeed, another hospice in Scottsdale
(Snow Bird Central) cannot fail.
Best wishes.
by Gorden Russell
Thanks, Steve.
by Gorden Russell
Thanks for the idea, stevewaclo, but I’ve never been the kind to inspire others.
If anybody else can take the ball and run with it, I can only hope that they do.
If there is a soul who can inspire others with Kickstarter to open up a hospice across the road from Alcor, just think of all the souls that can be saved until the Singularity.
by Gorden Russell
There is an article posted here that I just read on Christmas Eve.
“DNA motor ‘walks’ along nanotube, transports nanoparticle cargo
December 24, 2013″
This will lead to the little repair ‘bots that can fix any cellular damage caused by freezing.
by stevewaclo
Frankly, I wonder how many of us are qualified to weigh in on the technical aspects of this topic.
(New rule: all signature lines must be followed by credentials :-)
I’ll start: EE, ret. (Clearly unqualified to discuss the issue at hand.)
Sign me up for the debate!
by Gorden Russell
Oh c’mon, steve. Most of us here have learned more on our own as autodidacts than we did in school.
You can tell how qualified someone here is just by looking at what they write.
by Jason Adair
Thank goodness for the Internets.
by beephatron
he mentions a few superficial structures, like blood vessels, valves, sperm that can be frozen and re-thawed. Blood vessels are basically just tubes. Sperm is designed to be pretty hearty. It is designed to work autonomously and survive outside the body. What a carefully picked list of trivial tissues that can be re-animated. What about a brain? Or a Kidney? Or a liver? Do you think you might need these to not be a goop of broken cell walls? You may as well try re-animating a steak after it’s been in the broiler at 450. Minimum, you need a fully intact brain.
by Gorden Russell
Don’t be so quick to give up on a second life, beephatron. As a regular visitor here at this newsletter, you have seen how nanotechnology is advancing.
There are already many researchers working on nano-dumptrucks that can carry chemo right up to a cancer cell and put the toxins right into its nucleus.
It will be just the day after the Singularity when there will be nanocells that will move through your body when it is just a few calories above freezing and start to repair any damage. Yes, it will take a number of nanocells greater than the number of your body cells…but so what? Have you seen the recent stories that tell us that we already have a greater number of bacteria in our bodies than we have of our own body cells?
Sure, the task for these nano repair cells will be vast. But does it matter how long the job will take? You can’t be that impatient. You’ll already be dead.
by victorash
nice arguments
by GatorALLin
a new fashioned duel…. sweet… I’m heating up the popcorn now…
by Transhuman
Having been provided a tour first hand of Alcor in Scottsdale Arizona by Dr. Mike Perry himself, and having closely monitored information research within this field of study for over a decade, I, too would challenge Dr. Kaku to re-examine his stance on this subject.
In fact, I might point out that current research indicates that vitrification techniques might not be a requirement if advances in Magnetic-assisted cooling turn out to be effective.
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0051902
by tschaefer
The fact that Alcor gives tours is an OPSEC issue big enough for me to be concerned that it is assuming and highly dependent on normal social order. I think an off-grid self-sufficient undisclosed location in a cooler clime would be preferable.
by smb12321
If one has to worry about that much social unrest and physical danger then the chance of being revived is remote in the first place. It’s like those depending on Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid – all are only as good as our ability to pay (lol)
by Gorden Russell
Hey everybody, if you enter “Alcor Life Extension Foundation, East Acoma Drive, Scottsdale, AZ” into Google Maps, you can look at the facility and see some of what our friend Transhuman saw.
You will also notice from the satellite view, that the place is very close to the airport. This makes it easy for you to fly in while you are not quite dead.
Now if I win the Mega Millions, I’ll by one of those businesses across the street from Alcor and turn it into a hospice for those ready to go into suspension.
That way, when you do pass away, they can use the doctor on staff to pronounce you dead, then run a gurney right across the street so that you won’t have time to decay before going into your tube.